Need help pale chicks

[Chicken raiser393993]

If it's Mareks, not much you can do, but vitamins/min will give them a fighting chance. Any chicks/birds you bring in in the future will need to be vaccinated for Mareks. Hatcheries will vaccinate if you request it, or you can hatch your own eggs and vaccinate them yourself right after hatch. Of course you have to take extra precautions to make sure hatchery room and yourself is not contaminated with the virus. Any chicks you buy from feed stores will not be vaccinated. Even it they are, they are exposed in the store before vaccine has a chance to build immunity for them, so, that is for naught. Best way to get vaccinated chicks is direct from the hatchery, vaccinated, or hatch and vaccinate yourself. After you vaccinate them, they need to be basically in a sterile quarantine for 10 days before risking exposure. Which, makes even vaccinated hatchery chicks risky because of transport times. But, I would think the risk is more at the hatchery than the folks at the post office.

First thing I would do is treat all for cocci. Electrolyte imbalances can also cause the symptoms you describe. After treating for cocci, I would put a good vit electrolyte mix in their water and use that for a couple of weeks. Then for continued good health use it at least a few days a week. Avian Super Pack is a very good product, it doesnt' have a bunch of sodium or salt as first ingredient. Birds that are healthy can fight off disease much better than those with poor diets. I never trust the bagged feed to provide the necessary nutrients because sometimes a bag will not get proper mix, many times the feed has sat on the shelf six or more months! Old feed loses nutritional value. Improper storage (heat, humidity) causes it to break down even faster.

It is definitely not mareks (thank goodness) but I did believe it was cocci. I've been treating with corrid 9.6% for almost 2 weeks now, but I don't see much of a change. I did buy a pack for the electrolytes and I've been mixing it with their food for a week. It does not seem to be working. I thought both corrid and electrolytes would do the trick but I guess not. I'm going to try giving the more electrolytes pure, but I don't see it making a difference.

These are the three worst cases (the three amigos). See the bone on their faces, they are really skinny. All three should be full grown and crowing, but they couldn't grow.

 

[OwO]

I know this sounds basic but are you sure you're giving them enough of the right food?

 

[rebrascora]

What makes you say it definitely isn't Marek's?
If it was coccidiosis, they would have responded to treatment by now, assuming you are giving the correct dosage. By prolonging the Corid treatment, you are depleting their diet of a vital B vitamin, thiamine, so I would not continue with that for any longer and give a Vitamin B complex supplement to them as soon as you stop the Corid.

 

[andreanar]

Oh dear. If its cocci instead of Mareks, you should dose them right in their mouths. From what Ive read you should give Corid for 5-7 days then give them a break and give probiotics for awhile. My flock had cocci and your symptoms don't sound the same. And mine were improved after 3 days of Corid.
If you have proof your not dealing with Mareks, you should take one to the vet cause that appears to be more than cocci to me. Or maybe some form of cocci that doesn't respond to Corid? But then I would expect you to find blood in poop. Hmmmm

 

[andreanar]

Maybe @casportpony has some ideas?

 

[Stephine]

It is definitely not mareks (thank goodness) but I did believe it was cocci. I've been treating with corrid 9.6% for almost 2 weeks now, but I don't see much of a change. I did buy a pack for the electrolytes and I've been mixing it with their food for a week. It does not seem to be working. I thought both corrid and electrolytes would do the trick but I guess not. I'm going to try giving the more electrolytes pure, but I don't see it making a difference.View attachment 1085192 View attachment 1085193 View attachment 1085194 View attachment 1085196These are the three worst cases (the three amigos). See the bone on their faces, they are really skinny. All three should be full grown and crowing, but they couldn't grow.

If it was cocci and you have given them the right dose (look for dosage here on BYC) they would have gotten better in days, not weeks. So, first make sure your dosis was correct and if it was, stop the Corrid. It is not good for them to not be able to use Vitamin B for more than a few days (Corrid blocks Vitamin B uptake).
The electrolytes go into their drinking water, not their feed. Again, make sure you dose correctly by following the instructions on the package exactly. Often the instructions are for larger quantities than you need, so you might have to calculate to adjust it for your needs. Do NOT give Corrid and electrolyte vitamin mixes at the same time. The b vitamins in the electrolyte mix will reduce the effect of the Corrid.
Finally: what are they doing in the water bucket?

 

[MrsBachbach]

It is definitely not mareks (thank goodness) but I did believe it was cocci. I've been treating with corrid 9.6% for almost 2 weeks now, but I don't see much of a change. I did buy a pack for the electrolytes and I've been mixing it with their food for a week. It does not seem to be working. I thought both corrid and electrolytes would do the trick but I guess not. I'm going to try giving the more electrolytes pure, but I don't see it making a difference.View attachment 1085192 View attachment 1085193 View attachment 1085194 View attachment 1085196These are the three worst cases (the three amigos). See the bone on their faces, they are really skinny. All three should be full grown and crowing, but they couldn't grow.

When you treat with Corid you do not give vitamin supplements because you are just feeding the parasite if you do that. So if giving the full dosage of Corid, you do it for about 5 days then after that you can give them vitamin supplements. You may find that you have to treat them again later because not all birds get infected at the same time and it is going to take a few weeks of exposure for them to build up immunity. Regardless, they should have some immunity by now. The next thing I would suspect would be worms, like roundworms. So you need to get a wormer for chickens, either Wazine for poultry or Safeguard liquid for goats. You can do a search on this forum for dosage instructions for Safeguard. Wazine has instructions on the bottle. Lice or mites can make them legarthic and pale also. Too many can kill them. So get poultry dust for killing lice and dust your birds and maybe someone can give you some advice on what to use to rid your coop of mites if that is what is attacking them. Mites do not live on the bird, they come out at night and feed on the birds. Also, make sure they are getting a higher protein food also, at least 18% protein when growing them out like you are.

 

[MrsBachbach]

It is definitely not mareks (thank goodness) but I did believe it was cocci. I've been treating with corrid 9.6% for almost 2 weeks now, but I don't see much of a change. I did buy a pack for the electrolytes and I've been mixing it with their food for a week. It does not seem to be working. I thought both corrid and electrolytes would do the trick but I guess not. I'm going to try giving the more electrolytes pure, but I don't see it making a difference.View attachment 1085192 View attachment 1085193 View attachment 1085194 View attachment 1085196These are the three worst cases (the three amigos). See the bone on their faces, they are really skinny. All three should be full grown and crowing, but they couldn't grow.

One thing I didn't ask is how many are you raising and what is their space like? Are they in a garage or in a coop on the ground? If they are overcrowded in a pen, some may not be getting enough to eat. Extra feeding stations would be in order and a larger pen. Some more dominant birds keep others away from the feeders. The birds on bottom of pecking order (the weaker or more timid birds) will stay away from the feeder once they have been pecked a few times. They end up eating what they can find on the ground. If you have them inside a building, they would not be getting much sunlight or vit D and that can lead to illness to. But I would worm them first (I suggest use Safeguard) because they could be wormy if they have been on ground and those birds are in poor shape so you have to be careful on your dosage and do the dusting for lice, add a couple of extra feeders especially if you many birds and keep them on some vitamins/minerals in their water until they gain their health back. I would put them in a pen by themselves for a while until they get better just in case something else or disease is ailing them. It could take awhile for them to put weight back on.

 

[Chicken raiser393993]

Update on my chickens:
2 of the 3 that were in the worst shape died already. The third one is hanging on but still skinny and pale.

Others that were mildly affected are now worse. I'm talking about pullets and stags.

Now even some of the full grown chickens are becoming pale.

Ive tried wazine first on these same chickens, it had no affect on them. I've tried lemon, vinegar, and garlic; no change.

Ive tried corrid with mixed results, but mostly negative. Some pullets got better but they are still in rough shape. I had bantam juveniles with the sickness too but they seemed to fight it off naturally.

I have been giving them corrid in their water and electrolytes in their food for weeks, with no change.
I recently went on a 2 week trip which meant I gave the job of taking care of my chickens to a friend. She did not give them medicine obviously, just regular feed and water, some cleaning.

I came back to find that my chickens were in the same shape that I left them, meaning I wasted my time and money with the corrid and electrolytes.

When i came back I brought these pills for deworming which I gave to all of them, it was supposed to make them poop out the worms. There were no worms in their poop, none.

I gave them vitamin b12 shots because I don't know what else to do. I have over 80 chickens and over half of them are sick. I would not want to kill the sick ones because that is half my flock. Most are in cages 2ft off the ground witg sufficient space to run around and eat. I have full grown hens in coops on the floor, but these are pretty healthy. The ones in the cages have their place andwater cleaned daily. Food is a mixture of whole corn, chick start, and egg layer for extra protein. They also are fed fruit.

I've had chickens for over 10 years and this is the first time that disease gas ever gotten to them. I have given these extra care with the mixture of food, daily cleaning, and clean water.

Before I just gave my chickens corn and water, had them free range, they slept in the trees.

I have to keep them in cages because of raccoons and hawks but I let them go once in a while to dig. Recently I've been letting them dig in cages because I didn't want them eating their infected poop.

I still have no solution, I'm exhausted and I'm ready to throw in the towel. Just waiting for them to die out I guess.

Just a refresher, these are the symptoms:
*mostly young ones and chicks
*Pale face
*skinny bodies, skinny and bony faces
*watery poop
*some will have a paralyzed leg (these die out quick)
*some will be completely paralyzed (these become healed after 1-2 days of full paralysis then become completely better)

Ive also encountered other sicknesses that my chickens healed from:
*Yellow faces for adults (lemon and garlic)
*Snot in nose and smelly (just give daily lemon)

Someone help

 

[Stephine]

I am really sorry you are having such a hard time!
First off: Paralysis is not part of the symptoms of worm overload or coccidiosis so you are dealing with something else.
Why do you think you can exclude Marek's? It seems like that is very likely.

Corrid is given in a 5 day course. Giving it longer is useless and deprives the chickens of the b vitamins they need. Also, electrolytes are for chickens suffering from dehydration. If you are talking about an electrolytes/vitamin mix, that is not to be given at the same time as Corrid as it counteracts that medicine. You give vitamins (b vitamins in particular) *after* the five day course of corrid, because you have just been depriving their bodies of that vitamin for 5 days in order to weaken the cocci.
I am writing this for future reference and for others, as I really doubt your troubles have anything to do with coccidiosis. But when you buy and use medication always make sure to read the instructions carefully and follow them - otherwise you are just wasting your money and risking the health of your chickens...
Keeping chickens in cages is a recipe for all kinds of trouble. I realize that you only started doing this after some got sick, but you are not helping the issue and inviting additional trouble instead.
Are you giving them grit? While free ranging they could find their own, but put up in a cage you will have to supplement granit grit (not just oystershell or other calcium source) so they can properly digest their feed.
Do not feed corn in addition to a complete chicken feed, they will end up not getting enough protein overall, especially if you also feed fruit. Why feed starter and layer?? It's either, or. Starter is fine to feed forever if you give extra oyster shell free choice on the side. Do not feed layer feed to pullets before lay or to roosters, there's too much calcium in it and that will harm their kidneys over time.
If I were you I'd pick a good quality grower or all flock feed, offer oyster shell on the side and feed nothing else until everyone is better.
Read up on Marek's and evaluate again if that could be the problem...