Breeding charts

[bantams galore]

I am new to breeding for exhibition. I see all kind of line breeding charts out there, but are they all as good as the other? I am looking at something like these ones. I mean do I just pick one and get at it?

 

[bantams galore]

So if there are no comments on these charts, which charts have you used? what was the outcome?

 

[Shanty]

There is no formula for breeding chickens. And, first, you have to have a reason or some goals. Are you breeding for production? Exhibition? Color/genetics reasons? These charts are a guide only once you have an objective. You don't have to follow any of them. Even if you do, you will find that "the best laid plans" get sidetracked. Disease? Predators--animal or human? Changes in your vision based on exhibition results? Loss of the ONLY rooster you saved?

If you do have an objective, then select a chart you can live with. Do you realize how long it takes to follow one of the "plans"? Most folks don't and they get pretty frustrated early on. Most don't get past the second generation, if that far.

In any event, whatever YOU decide based on your objectives, have fun! Just don't become a slave to a plan when circumstances dictate that you CHANGE that plan.

Shannon

 

[bantams galore]

For me the goal is exhibition. I am looking at the charts and thinking that it depends on what you start with, which one you pick.

The cousin plan seems to blend every one of the 4 birds equally, so they would all have to be exceptional.

The 1/2 brother- 1/2 sister plan is really linebreeding to the male, because he is the same in both female lines, so If it is a male that I want to save the genes of, I might use that plan.

The skip generation plan linebreeds to the male, but uses grand sire to grand daughter, which is the same coeffient of inbreeding, but it is more risky, because you have some birds that have to live two years without getting eaten, or died, or something.

The other chart I like, because it is based on one mating each year, which keeps it small, but you still have have birds kept over that are doing nothing for a year. Although, if you have more than one generation then if something goes wrong you can go back a generation and try to fix it.


So, with my silkies, I have a crackerjack male. So if I started with the 1/2 sibling plan, and went a gerenation or two and found that raised the birds needed that one of the other plans worked better, then I would shift to that? is that what we are saying?

Or if I started with some other way and out of that I got that one great male and then changed to one of the plans that used him to the fullest until, I achieved something else?

That is the way I have been thinking, but is that the kind of thinking that you are talking about?

 

[Shanty]

Yes, if they can win 1sts and BB and SC, then you HAVE something with which to begin. You are correct here. Key word is exceptional. You can't produce exceptional birds from average birds no matter what system you use. If you don't SEE the phenotype, it won't simply "pop" out and be there when you mate your birds.

One of my old chicken partners, George Mihalik of New Mexico, is a Silkie breeder of note. I don't know what George would answer, but I do know this. When you start producing Silkies like George produced--like this:


Photo by George Mihalik

Then you can begin thinking about how to mate your birds because this is an EXCEPTIONAL bird. There is no easy answer, ever. I have seen them all work. The only way you will know is:

1) Have something worth breeding that actually SHOWS the characteristics you want to perpetuate (the phenotype)

2) Try line breeding (safe form of inbreeding in my estimation)

3) Try inbreeding

4) Select, select, select (if you can't select, then NO system will work)--this is the KEY element of breeding poultry, period



Photo by George Mihalik


5) Don't be afraid to change the plan IF need be. Inbreeding depression, infertility, etc.

6) Don't be afraid to go against conventional wisdom IF you need to out cross lines at the beginning, but then stick to the conventions of the "system" you choose. Conventional wisdom--DON'T ever out cross a line

Shan

 

[bantams galore]

I called George and got some information about raising silkies for show from him. I wrote notes for a couple of hours. I am not sure about about a few things he said, it was hard to understand his through his accent.

I Have one male that won best in class last fall.


The biggest fault that I have in my silks is hard tail feathers in the males. So I am not using any with hard feathers.

 

[Shanty]

And THAT is the real answer. I've known George for 30 years; he's a gem.

 

[Sonoran Silkies]

And THAT is the real answer. I've known George for 30 years; he's a gem.

Indeed he is.

 

[bantams galore]

I might be a little dense here, but which is the real answer, culling the faults of talking To George?

 

[donrae]

Wow.

I'm so not a silkie person. I mean, I know the basic characteristics of the breed, but not the SOP type details. But even I can see that's a beautiful, quality animal.

Just wow.